Post by Robert Bishop on Jun 12, 2007 21:00:53 GMT -5
I know that i know that i know that god is real because ive felt him and seen him answer prayer in my life and other peoples lives.If you have ever felt the holy spirit move upon you than there would be no doubt he lives
Post by Robert Bishop on Jun 12, 2007 21:10:39 GMT -5
If i remember the story correct the witch cried out when she realized it was Samuel and not a demon.GOD actually did bring Samuel up and asked why he disturbed his rest.Samuel told Saul that he would die and his sons and the next day he died and David soon became king
Post by Harold "Rattlesnake" Ryden on Jun 12, 2007 21:23:32 GMT -5
This is another topic about the same stuff we have gone over time and time again!!!
I see a lot of people have their head on straight and then you have a few who are in denial. Joe and Todd. Ryan is right, you choose not to believe... we can argue God all you want and you will still not believe!!
The smartest thing Satan ever did was make people not believe in him... in return they dont believe in God.
Look around guys... Miracles happen everyday. I am looking at 3 right now... my daughter and two sons... I see one every time I look in the mirror... I am talking to two right now...
Joe and Todd... even if you dont believe in God, he still loves you and longs to be with you every day. Maybe something happened to you guys, maybe your afraid of what really is true... I dont know and dont need to. God loves you and thats the bottom line!!!
Grab a bible and read this... John 3:16 Romans 3:23-24 Joshua 24:15
Before you talk smack about someone you should walk a mile in their shoes, that way, your a mile away and you have their shoes!
Post by Harold "Rattlesnake" Ryden on Jun 12, 2007 21:30:07 GMT -5
At Nationals last year, you injured your left arm... the ref said you broke your arm... everyone watching said you broke your arm... even you knew you broke your arm!!!! What did you tell the ref... I broke my right, I know what it feels like, I know I broke my arm!!! Right??
Instantly I prayed God would heal you and when I came down to you and told you that, you said you were fine and your arm was not broken... how did it go from broken to 5 minutes later not broken... miracle maybe??? I believe it!!! Do you?
Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 13, 2007 3:19:15 GMT -5
. I believe all things percieved as ghost are in fact ghost. Cause it says in the bible about bringing spirits back. I can't remember who it was in the bible it was one of the kings when he was running from the philistines I believe that his friend called up his friends spirit or something like that an it was in fact his spirit not a demon or angel. .
I was really just kiddin about you hurting yourself.
But as far as ghosts...........If you are refering to the lost souls of the dead.....then you are wrong...that is simply an unspriptural idea........the bible teaches that necromancys is an abomination.
And that to be seperate from the body is to be present with the lord. the story you are refering to was in 1 samuel 28
Topics: Familiar spirit
Text: Sorcerers or necormancers, who professed to call up the dead to answer questions, were said to have a "familiar spirit" (Deut. 18:11; 2 Kings 21:6; 2 Chr. 33:6; Lev. 19:31; 20:6; Isa. 8:19; 29:4). Such a person was called by the Hebrews an 'ob, which properly means a leathern bottle; for sorcerers were regarded as vessels containing the inspiring demon. This Hebrew word was equivalent to the pytho of the Greeks, and was used to denote both the person and the spirit which possessed him (Lev. 20:27; 1 Sam. 28:8; comp. Acts 16:16). The word "familiar" is from the Latin familiaris, meaning a "household servant," and was intended to express the idea that sorcerers had spirits as their servants ready to obey their commands.
7. Then said Saul unto his servants, Seek me a woman that hath a familiar spirit, that I may go to her, and inquire of her. And his servants said to him, Behold, there is a woman that hath a familiar spirit at Endor. 8. And Saul disguised himself, and put on other raiment, and he went, and two men with him, and they came to the woman by night: and he said, I pray thee, divine unto me by the familiar spirit, and bring me him up, whom I shall name unto thee. 9. And the woman said unto him, Behold, thou knowest what Saul hath done, how he hath cut off those that have familiar spirits, and the wizards, out of the land: wherefore then layest thou a snare for my life, to cause me to die? 10. And Saul sware to her by the Lord, saying, As the Lord liveth, there shall no punishment happen to thee for this thing. 11. Then said the woman, Whom shall I bring up unto thee? And he said, Bring me up Samuel. 12. And when the woman saw Samuel, she cried with a loud voice: and the woman spake to Saul, saying, Why hast thou deceived me? for thou art Saul. 13. And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth. 14. And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself. 15. And Samuel said to Saul, Why hast thou disquieted me, to bring me up? And Saul answered, I am sore distressed; for the Philistines make war against me, and God is departed from me, and answereth me no more, neither by prophets, nor by dreams: therefore I have called thee, that thou mayest make known unto me what I shall do. 16. Then said Samuel, Wherefore then dost thou ask of me, seeing the Lord is departed from thee, and is become thine enemy?
Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 13, 2007 3:24:21 GMT -5
The "spirit" that was seen in the case you mentioned as quoted in samuel 28 was from a woman with a "familiar spirit" she was a necromancer....a woman who "spoke to the dead". According to the above scriptural defenition this woman was demon possessd and was speaking not to samuel but to demons
A demon does not have the power to raise the dead....and they do not have the moral capacity to do the work of the lord.
If this womaan was demon posssessd, it is spiritualy impossible for the image that was seen to have been from God.
The scripture indicated that the woman was the only one to see this image and was likely speaking for the spirit. rather than saul actually commmunicating with samuel.
dont you think that everything that happens around us is a miracle?why do we need to proof that there is a GOD by using extra ordinary things?so if no miracle then there is no GOD?i can find HIM in everywhere i look at as long as i keep my mind clean from the life understanding that established mankind system tries to wash my mind with.miracles are for people with weak faith,the one who believes by the eyes will quit believing by the eyes.
men always wanted to deny the facts,years ago they said they wouldnt believe in what they cant see.so it means that there was no bacteries or other things that we can not see with eyes till technologic help invested(according to their understanding).mankind would like to know everything without realising how limited they are about brain capacity (which we use less than 10 percent of it),hearing,seing and feeling.they can not explain even most of what they see but they would like to fully understand and see WHO created them.they are so weak that it was not asked to them when they born,and will not be asked when their lives end.they always judge the things with the earthly understanding,for example gravity,it works here but it does not work in space.so not everything that we have here is the same with the rest of the universe.they try to understand what was before GOD,or what is after,after,after after....i am sorry but it is another miscalculation as mankind once thought that the world was flat.to our understanding everything has before and after because we are in an obedience test here and every test has a beginning and an end.so our clock is the sun.if you take away the sun,what will you count as before and after?and what will be our time understanding?or think from the other side,if i am wrong about what i am saying then we can go by the atheist understanding.so there is no god because you would like to find an answer what was before and what is after,above,further,further,further... so which answer do you receive now?where do you reach now?do you have any answer of your question that is created by less than 10% percent of your brain capacity which had no idea when and in which shape to be born and when and in which shape to die?the biggest mistake of mankind is to forget that he is limited and deny everything that he can not understand.
Ghost??....there's medication for that....lol....i know some day i'll be old and dying and i'll find God somehow.....but i'll probably have alheismers when it happens....i was raised by an Athiest.....and he was a good man that taught me the way of the world without making me fear a superior being....i've met Ryan and he's a good guy and he beleives deeply in what he preaches. i've got respect for that...but as i seen a few post by Harold saying same ole thing the Atheist are saying....well Ryan opens the door for both good & bad when he makes a thread for God.....and i have lost people close to me. that doesn't mean i hate God....i just don't beleive there's one up there or down below....life is what you make it while you're alive....worm food is what you are when you're dead....make it count the first time around just in case your HEAVEN theory is faulty? there is still no proof of either...just heresay
Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 13, 2007 11:52:24 GMT -5
Also, dont you think you should make it count just in case YOUR theory is faulty??
Todd....id take this comment far more serious than just surface value.....
if my beliefs are wrong....then we will both be worm food.....and nothing will happen......BUT if you theory is wrong....im going t heaven ....and you will spend an enternity in hell seperate from a loving God who at so many time in yur has reached outto you...
if your going to live like there is no god....you had better be sure of it
BTW what did you mean by i open the door for god and bad?
i would not call it a subject of religion but a natural faith of mankind in the Creator of everything.i believe in miracles too,but i just can not let my faith depending on miracles because IMO life and everything in it are the miracles of the Creator.
Post by Johnny Edwards on Jun 13, 2007 12:43:10 GMT -5
But it does say it was Samuel an Samuel was dead. I didn't say it was right to do necromancy I was just saying that it talked about a spirit being brought back in that text. I find it hard to believe that when I saw what I thought was a ghost that it was actually a demon cause demons have the power to put fear in you they are evil, VERY EVIL. They have nothing bu hate sown into them an no good whatsoever neither did it seem like an angel because it didn't give me a good feeling either it was just there an something that made me go wow there really is a God it just strengthens my faith. I don't believe in necromancy or people like Sylvia Browne. I just think that as far as ghost well it's hard to explain it when I can't really find that much in the bible about them. Does that mean it's not there though???? IT doesn't mention marijuana in the bible either or smoking ciggarettes from what I can remember but they are here an it's wrong to smoke them an we know that cause it says not to harm the temple an they can kill you with cancers.
But it also says that the Angels that fell out of heaven with Lucifer are chained in Darkness reserved unto the day of judgment. So who are the demons then??? If they are chained they aren't going anywheres?????? Thats just something I am unsure of right now an I know I still have a lot of growing up in christ to do but from what i have read about that so far I just don't see where the demons would come from because they are chained up. Satan doesn't have the power to make new beings??? He isn't God...... Although he is a god of this world or more a demi evil god. God lets him walk in an out of this world at his choosing. He even walked into heaven to one of Gods counsels. Cause right now he is free to do what he wants. But I would love if you would help me out on the ghost subject though cause I have seen things before that I could tell you about that makes me think well idk... But I don't positively believe something till I study an figure out for myself what I think an I always keep God in what I choose an I pray about everything. If I study a subject I always ask God to give me a firm understanding of the subject an to help me with Discernment of the spirit. Well help would be appreciated though Ryan.
Post by Johnny Edwards on Jun 13, 2007 12:49:59 GMT -5
It does say he talked to Samuel though not a demon the woman had demons in her in order to consult the dead but it says that Samuel did talk to Saul so thats a spirit it doesn't say Samuel was a demon.
That didn't help at all. I need to read again their was something I read in the bible that made me believe that there are ghost. Cause where does it say we go straight to heaven or hell as soon as we die? cause if it says it in the old testament when Jesus came along a lot of stuff changed. Didn't hell use to be located at the center of the earth???? then it was moved. Where does it say in the New Testament that you are Judged right when you die I thought the great white throne judgement happened at the End of Time???
Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 13, 2007 13:02:20 GMT -5
12. And when the woman saw Samuel, she cried with a loud voice: and the woman spake to Saul, saying, Why hast thou deceived me? for thou art Saul. 13. And the king said unto her, Be not afraid: for what sawest thou? And the woman said unto Saul, I saw gods ascending out of the earth. 14. And he said unto her, What form is he of? And she said, An old man cometh up; and he is covered with a mantle. And Saul perceived that it was Samuel, and he stooped with his face to the ground, and bowed himself.
the highlighted part. indicates to me that saul did not know it was samuel. he just "percieved" it was samuel....therefore...he did not see him nor did he speak directly to him.
he spoke through this woman....have you ever watched one of those spook shows? they dont know who or if they are speaking to anyone. they speak through people like silvia brown...and i my friend believe it is very real...but very evil.